Sounds Like Hate

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JAMILA PAKSIMA:  FOR MORE THAN A YEAR, WE’VE BEEN UNCOVERING THE TRUTH ABOUT THE BASE, AN INTERNATIONAL WHITE POWER TERRORIST GROUP PLOTTING FOR A RACE WAR.

Rinaldo Nazzaro: We’re looking for guys who are willing to accept a degree of risk and believe that what we’re trying to do is worth it.

YVONNE LATTY: SOUNDS LIKE HATE IS A PODCAST SERIES FROM THE SOUTHERN POVERTY LAW CENTER. I’M YVONNE LATTY.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: AND I’M JAMILA PAKSIMA. A WARNING TO OUR LISTENERS, MUCH OF WHAT YOU HEAR MAY BE VIOLENT AND DISTURBING. LIKE THIS RECORDING MADE BY FORMER BASE MEMBER PATRIK MATHEWS AS HE WORE A GAS MASK AND CAPTURED A VIDEO OF HIS VIOLENT PLANS.

Patrik Mathews: The time for violent revolution is now, derail some [bleep] trains, kill some people and poison some water supplies.

YVONNE LATTY: IN OUR FIRST SEASON, WE REVEALED HOW THE BASE HAD A SPRAWLING NETWORK OF RECRUITS WHO MET AND TRAINED REGULARLY WITH FIREARMS.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: SINCE THEN, MEMBERS IN DIFFERENT SMALL CELLS ACROSS THE UNITED STATES HAVE BEEN ARRESTED AND ARE AWAITING THEIR TRIALS. HERE ARE THE LATEST DEVELOPMENTS ON THEIR CASES.

News Anchor: A former Canadian Forces reservist and alleged neo-Nazi is back in a Maryland courtroom. Patrik Mathews’ lawyers are attempting to throw out two of the four weapons charges filed against him.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: AUDIO OBTAINED BY THE FBI SUGGESTED THE MARYLAND BASE MEMBERS HAD PLANNED TO CARRY OUT A VIOLENT ATTACK IN 2020 IN RICHMOND, VIRGINIA, AT A PRO-GUN RIGHTS RALLY.  ACCUSED WERE 35-YEAR-OLD BRIAN MARK LEMLEY JR., AKA “CAN’T GO BACK,” A FORMER CAVALRY SCOUT IN THE U.S. ARMY, AND PATRIK MATHEWS, 29, AKA “DAVE” OR “JIMMY,” A FORMER CANADIAN ARMED FORCES RESERVIST. THE JUDGE IN THE CASE REJECTED THAT THIS WAS JUST HARMLESS TALK AMONG FRIENDS. THESE TWO BASE MEMBERS FROM MARYLAND CONFESSED TO THEIR GUN-RELATED CRIMES AND WERE NOT CONVICTED OF DOMESTIC TERRORISM. THEIR SENTENCING HEARING TOOK PLACE OCT. 28, 2021.

YVONNE LATTY: OUR PRODUCER, JORDAN GASS-POORE, ATTENDED THE SENTENCING HEARING IN THE FEDERAL COURTHOUSE IN GREENBELT, MARYLAND.

Jordan Gass-Poore: It was very obvious to me that more attention was being paid, at least from the press that I knew was present in the courtroom, to Patrik Mathews. His hair is about down to the middle of his back, and he has a real bushy beard and mustache. It was difficult with all that facial hair to read his face and what he was thinking.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: IN THE FEDERAL COURTROOM AT THE SENTENCING HEARING WAS WINNIPEG FREE PRESS REPORTER RYAN THORPE, WHO SECRETLY INFILTRATED THE GROUP IN CANADA IN 2019. HE SAYS PATRIK MATHEWS READ A STATEMENT TO THE JUDGE.

Ryan Thorpe: He said that when he was in The Base, he, I guess, felt a desire to fit in, and it became a competition who could be the most extreme.

News Anchor: According to court documents, Patrik Mathews and his co-accused wanted to instigate a civil war that would decimate racial and ethnic minorities and subjugate women. And what this judge found was that there was sufficient evidence to show that they intended to murder U.S. federal law enforcement officials.

YVONNE LATTY:  PATRIK MATHEWS AND BRIAN MARK LEMLEY WERE BOTH SENTENCED TO NINE YEARS WITH THREE YEARS OF SUPERVISED RELEASE. THIS IS U.S. ATTORNEY EREK BARRON IN THE FOLLOWUP PRESS CONFERENCE.

News Anchor: A third individual, Mr. William Bilbrough, was already sentenced to five years in federal prison. These men sought to divide our community based on hate and through acts of violence and terror.  

JAMILA PAKSIMA: IN GEORGIA, THREE BASE CELL MEMBERS FROM THE WHITE POWER EXTREMIST GROUP HAVE BEEN HELD WITHOUT BOND FOR MORE THAN A YEAR FOR THEIR ALLEGED INVOLVEMENT IN WHAT PROSECUTORS DESCRIBE AS A PLOT TO MURDER AN ACTIVIST HUSBAND AND WIFE. JACOB KADERLI, AKA PESTILENCE, LUKE AUSTIN LANE, AKA THE MILITANT BUDDHIST, OR TMB, AND MICHAEL HELTERBRAND, AKA HELTER SKELTER, HAVE ALL PLEADED NOT GUILTY.

YVONNE LATTY: ANOTHER TWO MEN IN A MICHIGAN BASE CELL ARE AWAITING TRIAL FOR ALLEGEDLY TERRORIZING A FAMILY AT THEIR HOME.

Preliminary-Exam Hearing: The State of Michigan v. Justen Watkins.

YVONNE LATTY: JUSTEN WATKINS IS 26 AND ALSO KNOWN AS A.K. HE IS THE SELF-PROCLAIMED LEADER OF THE MICHIGAN BASE. AND ALFRED GORMAN, IS 36.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: WATKINS REMAINS IN JAIL AFTER VIOLATING HIS BOND TERMS IN MAY.

YVONNE LATTY: GORMAN IS FREE ON BOND.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: IN AUGUST 2021, PROSECUTORS ADDED FOUR ADDITIONAL COUNTS TO WATKINS’ CHARGES FOR GANG MEMBERSHIP, CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT, TEACH AND USE FIREARMS FOR A CIVIL DISORDER AND FOR LARCENY AT A FORMER MICHIGAN PRISON PROPERTY.

YVONNE LATTY: TWO ADDITIONAL MEN WERE CHARGED FOR THE SAME CRIMES, THOMAS DENTON, 32, AND TRISTAN WEBB, 19. SHORTLY AFTER THE ARREST, WEBB POSTED BOND. DENTON’S BOND WAS REVOKED, AND HE REMAINS IN JAIL AWAITING SENTENCING. HE PLEADED NO CONTEST TO TWO CHARGES, AND TWO OTHERS WERE DROPPED. HE FACES A MAXIMUM OF FOUR YEARS IN PRISON. THE CASES AGAINST WEBB AND WATKINS ARE ONGOING. THEY EACH FACE A MAXIMUM OF 20 YEARS IN PRISON.

Chanting: “Jews will not replace us…”

CBS anchor: During the ‘Unite the Right’ Rally in 2017…

Chanting: “Jews will not replace us…”

CBS anchor: White nationalists marched through the streets. They carried torches and clashed with counterprotesters.

YVONNE LATTY: IN CHARLOTTESVILLE, THE LONG-AWAITED TRIAL OF WHITE SUPREMACISTS ASSOCIATED WITH 2017 “UNITE THE RIGHT” RALLY HAS BEGUN. NINE PEOPLE INJURED AT THE RALLY ARE SUING ORGANIZERS. THE LAWSUIT CLAIMS THE RALLY’S ORGANIZERS CONSPIRED TO COMMIT VIOLENCE MOTIVATED BY RACE. THIS IS THE FIRST MAJOR CIVIL SUIT TO CITE AN 1871 LAW TO COUNTER KU KLUX KLAN RACE VIOLENCE. THE EVENT BEGAN AS A PROTEST AGAINST THE CITY’S PLAN TO REMOVE A STATUE OF CONFEDERATE GEN. ROBERT E. LEE FROM A PUBLIC PARK. IT ENDED IN THE MURDER OF COUNTERPROTESTER HEATHER HEYER AND INJURED 30 OTHERS. AMY SPITALNICK IS THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF INTEGRITY FIRST FOR AMERICA. THEY’RE A NONPROFIT CIVIL RIGHTS GROUP THAT’S REPRESENTING THE PLAINTIFFS.

Amy Spitalnick: The fact that so many have rallied around these plaintiffs and around this case is just incredibly heartening to see, and I hope that this case is able to provide some semblance of the justice the Charlottesville community has just been so sorely lacking over the last four years. It’s not going to solve it by any means, but it can hopefully provide a little bit of justice.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: UP NEXT, IS OUR MULTIPART STORY UNWELCOME.  WE REPORT FROM THE ARIZONA/MEXICO BORDER, WHERE SOME MILITIA GROUPS AND VIGILANTES, TAKE THE LAW INTO THEIR OWN HANDS, PUTTING LIVES OF MIGRANTS AT RISK.

Michael Meyer:  We don’t need to import more evil into America.

YVONNE LATTY: THEY DESTROY THEIR WATER SOURCES AND CALL U.S. BORDER PATROL. SOME PEOPLE SAY THESES VIGILANTES DETAIN MIGRANTS THEMSELVES AND HAND THEM OVER TO BORDER PATROL.

JAMILA PAKSIMA: UNDOCUMENTED MIGRANTS ARE CROSSING IN RECORD NUMBERS. MOST HAVE FLED TERRIBLE SITUATIONS IN THEIR HOME COUNTRIES. RATHER THAN A HUMANE RECEPTION, THEY ARE BEING TARGETED FOR CRUEL TREATMENT BY MILITIAS, OFTEN WITH WHAT LOOKS LIKE TACIT SUPPORT FROM SOME BORDER PATROL AGENTS. 

Tim Foley: When the government can’t protect you, you can protect yourself. And that’s what we’re doing.

Jamila Paksima:  But these people, most of the people that you find aren’t armed.

YVONNE LATTY: SOUNDS LIKE HATE IS PRODUCED BY UNTIL 20 PRODUCTIONS AND FUNDED BY THE SOUTHERN POVERTY LAW CENTER. SUBSCRIBE TO FIND OUT WHEN NEW EPISODES ARE RELEASED. I’M YVONNE LATTY

JAMILA PAKSIMA: AND I’M JAMILA PAKSIMA. REMEMBER TO RATE AND REVIEW. IT REALLY HELPS. THANK YOU FOR LISTENING.